What if there was no afterlife?

First topic message reminder :

Suppose someone proved there was no afterlife how would this affect you, I don't mean regarding your beliefs as such, but would it make you more fearful of death?

Joanie wrote:

zerdini wrote:

Joanie wrote:

zerdini wrote:

Joanie wrote:

zerdini wrote:

Joanie wrote:I would know Ken's voice anywhere,Violet.
He had a deep melodious voice,very pleasant.
I think he was trying to prove to me that he was still around or giving me proof there was life after death.

Joanie xx

Undoubtedly.

He always said he would,Z and he did and in lots of other ways as well.

Joanie

"in lots of other ways as well".............such as?

Do I have to answer that?

Lots of messages from him,always felt him around in the beginning after he passed but even those small signs seem to be getting less and less..................

Of course you don't have to answer, Joan. I was just following the thread.

I know,my answer came out the wromg way.

Joanie x

mac wrote:The way you describe things it's almost as if you're consciously rejecting the very essence of spiritual - that of the non-physical, the etheric, human form. I'd feel 'wob-sided' if I were to think of myself in such terms but I fully accept that's how things feel for you.

thanks for your explanation

You're welcome. I don't reject the non-physical/etheric human form as such - In fact I think that's an important aspect of being human - Our body is part of our whole, but it isn't a prison. That's what I was alluding to with my description of "....Best way I can explain it is when that line of separation between “You” and the physical world (be that something alive or inanimate) starts to blur.. When you start to kind of melt and leave your skin...." - When you start to transcend those levels of consciousness... And yes, one way of putting it is when you loose awareness of your body - When you just 'are'.

What I am dubious of (though I don't totally reject) is the notion that there's a 'Spirit' world/dimension/afterlife (call it what you will), and as such I don't include it in my present interpretation of 'Spirituality'.

I'm curious to know what your definition is - It might help me put this conversation into context a little more.

Dilettante wrote:

mac wrote:The way you describe things it's almost as if you're consciously rejecting the very essence of spiritual - that of the non-physical, the etheric, human form. I'd feel 'wob-sided' if I were to think of myself in such terms but I fully accept that's how things feel for you.

thanks for your explanation

You're welcome. I don't reject the non-physical/etheric human form as such - In fact I think that's an important aspect of being human - Our body is part of our whole, but it isn't a prison. That's what I was alluding to with my description of "....Best way I can explain it is when that line of separation between “You” and the physical world (be that something alive or inanimate) starts to blur.. When you start to kind of melt and leave your skin...." - When you start to transcend those levels of consciousness... And yes, one way of putting it is when you loose awareness of your body - When you just 'are'.

What I am dubious of (though I don't totally reject) is the notion that there's a 'Spirit' world/dimension/afterlife (call it what you will), and as such I don't include it in my present interpretation of 'Spirituality'.

I'm curious to know what your definition is - It might help me put this conversation into context a little more.

"I'm curious to know what your definition is...." I don't have a personal definition. For me - and others of a similar persuasion I suspect - life in the so-called world of spirit (actually there are no worlds which are not of the spirit ) is as 'real' as the world in which we're presently living. I have to use ' ' around some words as it's hard to find suitable alternatives. I suppose that your, quote,: "....line of separation between “You” and the physical world" for yourself is an intimation that you differentiate between physical and spiritual / etheric.

The so-called afterlife (and the 'beforelife' too) is, for me, just one dimension in which I have lived, and the one is where I will continue to live after my physical body has stopped functioning. Beyond that it becomes a highly-detailed situation which may be discussed at length (and often has been!) by those who understand and accept it.

Reading again what you've written, you're suggesting much the same apart, perhaps, from having an identifiable state of after-life. I'm guessing that for you, out-of-the-body and in-the-body take place in the same dimension? It appears to be how you perceive your situation.

Would that be correct?

OH good grief! LOL I just read down those posts then and felt like I was being sucked into a vortex with all the quotes

Rainbow wrote:OH good grief! LOL I just read down those posts then and felt like I was being sucked into a vortex with all the quotes

A necessary evil when one is trying hard to avoid the poor grammar levels evident at times on forum boards.

Additionally it's likely to mean more to the poster to whom I was replying.

Joanie wrote:

Joanie wrote:

zerdini wrote:

Joanie wrote:

zerdini wrote:

Joanie wrote:

zerdini wrote:

Joanie wrote:I would know Ken's voice anywhere,Violet.
He had a deep melodious voice,very pleasant.
I think he was trying to prove to me that he was still around or giving me proof there was life after death.

Joanie xx

Undoubtedly.

He always said he would,Z and he did and in lots of other ways as well.

Joanie

"in lots of other ways as well".............such as?

Do I have to answer that?

Lots of messages from him,always felt him around in the beginning after he passed but even those small signs seem to be getting less and less..................

Of course you don't have to answer, Joan. I was just following the thread.

I know,my answer came out the wromg way.

Joanie x

Just to explain myself.
Lights going on and off,mysterious cut outs in elctricity,everything electric which pointed to Ken.
Remember in his working life,he worked with electricity.
I took that as proof that he was around.

There is an afterlife. i say that because i know :-)

emsii wrote:There is an afterlife. i say that because i know :-)

How do you know?

I'm curious myself.

i know because i have sat in physical demonstrations and spoken and held loved ones who have passed. i know because i have left my body and went out into the hallway and with a thought i whooshed into my daughters room. that was me without my body. SO I KNOW! and i so know without a tiny hint of a doubt. i absolutely know as iv had my proof. my proof came from physical manifestations and not just mental mediumship. you lose someone and months later you are in a seance room and you are talking to them and holding their hands. THAT IS PROOF! thats how i know

You are very lucky to have attended a PM demonstration,Ensii.

I think that would convince me a 100% too.

Can you describe the manifestations a little more? What form did they take?

solid form like you and me. my sis was very emotional and though she talked, grandma had to take her away as she was so upset. she left 2 young girls. but she stayed and talked a while but was very upset and emotional. then left and grandma came back in and said sorry we had to take her back, she was very upset. so...solid, same person, same voice. absolutely wonderful. sadly there are very few such mediums today. you either have it or you dont. i know of a circle that has sat 20years each week and getting raps. you've got to give it to them, the dedication of sitting so long every week. they have accepted the medium is not a physical medium, but they still sitting and hoping some day one will join them who will be the person x

ps. another wonderful thing happening now - my sons facebook account has been accessed twice. no one had his password and yet from the spirit world he has somehow added a friend and today erased my sisters comment. she just rang me laughing and saying..hey! my comments been erased! we both laughed. they live on a faster vibration..so hey! is he playing with the electronics to do with facebook? he must be. no one can access his account but him. and its happened twice this week!!!

emsii wrote:There is an afterlife. i say that because i know :-)

I agree with you on the afterlife, as I know as well.

knowledge is wonderful to have. thats a big difference to saying i believe. proof brings knowledge hence some of us are able to say I KNOW! its becos we know. not becos we believe. belief is what certain faiths give you. they preach hope and belief. but is that enough? not for me...NO! i had to have proof. and with my proof i had my knowledge. so...no..i dont believe and hope in an afterlife. i KNOW there is an after life! there is one. always has been. and always will be. you can hope in it. you can believe in it. up to you and everyone to their own, but that just was not good enough for me. i had to find out it truly existed and i went to search for proof and i got my proof many times. is there an after life? i KNOW :-) I KNOW :-) YES THERE IS ONE. AND THAT IS TESTED AND PROVEN!

No one thinks you are being sarcastic,Stephen.

We all believe deep inside but sometimes those small doubts still creep in.

Thank you Joan.
I deleted my post as I felt both Mac and Emsii to be truly
sincere in their personal conviction and I was concerned that
my personal happiness for them could be mistaken and taken
as being sarcastic.
I do agree with you.Doubt is possibly always there.
I have on occasions imagined how I would feel to have someone hold
a loaded gun to my head and start to pull the trigger.
It happened to my father when in South Africa he was
attacked by robbers.The gun misfired and the crooks ran away.
My dad was never quite the same after that.
He became a kinder more considerate person.A close
brush with death can do things to people.
Stephen

emsii wrote:ps. another wonderful thing happening now - my sons facebook account has been accessed twice. no one had his password and yet from the spirit world he has somehow added a friend and today erased my sisters comment. she just rang me laughing and saying..hey! my comments been erased! we both laughed. they live on a faster vibration..so hey! is he playing with the electronics to do with facebook? he must be. no one can access his account but him. and its happened twice this week!!!

Ummm... I *strongly* suggest that passwords are changed. If this has happened as you describe, someone either has the details, or (and possibly worse) someone's successfully guessed/hacked the account.

It's a frequent occurrence. Make the new password complicated - There's nothing stopping you sharing the new details with spirit.

When we see death approaching,the fear will disappear. I feel we are endowed with a peacefulness towards the end.

I was diagnosed as suffering from Angina and the worst and only attack I had was when I was out shopping in town,some years ago.

I honestly felt I was going to die.

Anyway,all was well and I recovered.

But at that time,I had no fear of death,I didn't want to die but the fear went.

I didn't have any feeling that spirit was around me,I felt nothing at all.

But I didn't care or worry anything.

But for some reason,the fear of death had gone.

I can understand your father's feelings,near death can change our attitude and feelings.

It can make us stronger,it can also make us more determined not to waste our life and to stand up to those who would do us ill.

But also to be kinder to those who are kind to us.

That is how I feel now.

I feel we're somehow 'prepared' be that in dreams or visits that we may deny or brush off not wanting to believe or acknowledge it.

hi. his passwords were totally impossible to hack. they usually consisted of about 50 characters with numbers im told. and this only has happened twice. if anyone had access im sure they would have done more. i am happy to have had my total certainty of continuation of life after this earth plane. its not an inner knowing for me. iv seen and held those we call dead who are alive in fact living a life more alive than the ones we live on our lower vibration called earth. i'l keep posted when i attend my next physical demonstration which i hope to atttend december and also march. Blessings x

Hi Emsii, spirits can use equipment, i'm in no doubt of that will look forward to hearing about your upcoming events.

Violet" Hi Emsii, spirits can use equipment, i'm in no doubt of that will look fo....


".....spirits can use equipment,....."

It's an interesting notion and one difficult to prove or disprove.... Other electrical/electronic occurrences have been reported in the past but they were never systematic, predictable or reproducible. Hence they have no power to persuade generally.

If it's possible, why, one might ask, would discarnates choose to make their presence known in obscure ways as are now being discussed? Such claimed situations are the electronic equivalents of other claimed phenomena.

Thus far any genuine phenomena (and I'm not discounting 'em, just raising questions) appear to be highly localised, maybe accidental and pretty uncommon. They can have great significance on those whom they affect but otherwise have precious little impact.

Perhaps that's the way that our unseen friends will now prefer to make their presence known - on a personal basis using the new communication media which appeal to the modern generation perhaps?

These are just my personal thoughts on the matter, though, and I've yet to hear anyone saying the same.